Ayr Wargames Club

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johnny789



Posts : 209
Join date : 2016-01-16

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Sat Mar 12 2016, 16:36

Guys remember that the club is not on tomorrow.


Steve, we have looked at other venues but all the others we found were much more expensive than where we are at the moment. Anywhere council owned is just completely crazy prices. It would be better if we could work something out here.

John
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Steve (Admin)
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Posts : 44
Join date : 2011-01-15
Age : 49
Location : Maybole

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Sat Mar 12 2016, 14:15

Surely if things are getting more difficult to maintain a regular club meeting at the Church Hall then perhaps a new venue should be considered?

Just saying.
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http://ayrwargamesclub.co.uk
ScotR



Posts : 241
Join date : 2013-11-25

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Thu Mar 10 2016, 22:51

I'd certainly considered going to the Prestwick club on a Wednesday night on the odd occasion as I can't always make the Sunday. Maybe making an effort to do so would open things up a bit between the clubs, these things can be quite secular sometimes.

I'd also reclarify that I wasn't suggesting replacing the forum and requiring everyone to have a facebook account. I see a Facebook group as a more visible waypoint directing everyone to the forum. At the moment, that's kinda like using Kate Upton to draw folk in, then sending them to see Susan Boyle... but that can be worked on.

In on the 20th next, would be good to get half an hour with everyone to discuss it all in person.
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johnny789



Posts : 209
Join date : 2016-01-16

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Thu Mar 10 2016, 22:08

The problem with that Dave is that Sunday is probably not suitable for them, and I think trying to poach another Club's members might cause some animosity. It would be ideal if we could mix in players from both clubs but a lot of our members wouldn't be able to attend another club through the week

It looks like keeping to 16 and over is the best way to go, it is a pity but the implications of getting younger members is too much hassle.

Whatever way we go with fees etc Scot, it has to be as fair as possible for all. But I certainly don't mind a higher weekly fee or adding in a yearly one of payment too. All in all it isn't that much for all the enjoyment I get from our hobby.

We can all think about everything brought up and have a chat over the next few weeks, then we can decide which way we will go.

I certainly think our forum is badly underused and I would prefer to use it as a means of getting all our games organised.

John
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David McQ



Posts : 79
Join date : 2014-11-26

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Thu Mar 10 2016, 21:56

Plus the easy solution to the fb/forum issue and double post issue is to use the forum for who's coming in on what days, arranging anything official, stuff like that. And use Fb for the flashy advertising/first contact for new members. Fill it with photos of games, contact info, prices and general things that's happening. Best of both worlds.
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David McQ



Posts : 79
Join date : 2014-11-26

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Thu Mar 10 2016, 21:53

This other club that's on wed, I think. What about getting some of them to come on a sun, at least as a short term solution? Would inject a bit more money/bodies into the club per week.
Plus George knows the guys and could sound them out?
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David Sargent



Posts : 101
Join date : 2011-01-28
Location : Innerleithen

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Thu Mar 10 2016, 17:14

Yes Doc. Hope to be there for a wee while anyway. May pick up a few figures that I'm never going to have the time to paint Crying or Very sad

DS
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ScotR



Posts : 241
Join date : 2013-11-25

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Thu Mar 10 2016, 16:22

Yeah, think keeping it over 16 is the easiest option. It's changed days from 20 years ago when we were youngsters. Besides, I imagine they spend most of their time in the GW in the town if they want to do any gaming.

I'm not adverse to a price increase per week, but I'm only in once a month usually. What may be 6 quid for me could be 24 for someone else with better attendance.
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Doc



Posts : 244
Join date : 2011-01-21
Location : In front of my computer Duh!

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Thu Mar 10 2016, 15:42

Although it is made out the PVG scheme is different, it still involves checks for every individual group, club or work environment you will be using it for.  After the initial cost to the individual to join the scheme, the organisation has to then pay to check your PVG if it is an existing PVG membership & a further fee if anything is "discovered" to find out what that is.
I'm sure all the hassle of Disclosure was the reason we decided to not have under 16s at the club and it was one less headache.  As you say Dave, the checked person will always have to be there, so what happens if they are ill or on holiday, etc.  Would mean you would probably need 2 people.

On a lighter note, are you going along to Dumfries this weekend?
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David Sargent



Posts : 101
Join date : 2011-01-28
Location : Innerleithen

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Thu Mar 10 2016, 15:08

The old disclosure procedure had to be completed for EVERY different situation where you had contact with vulnerable groups. I've had about six done for my different teaching/tutoring/coaching over the years.

However the new PVG apparently is done every three years and is universal. I am just having to renew mine. The trouble with the new certification, however, is that you have to state in the application whether it is to cover contact with adults or children. My current one will be for adults only because I no longer teach in schools.

I have no idea what all this costs as mine is paid for by the Regional Council but it does make coping with under 16's in your club/organisation much more difficult as you obviously need someone with the certificate to be present whenever they are.
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George

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Posts : 273
Join date : 2011-10-30

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Thu Mar 10 2016, 13:22

Don't we need at least 1 attending member each week with a disclosure to do that?
Unfortunately I think mine is obsolete and I'm not overly inclined to renew(£26-44) as I wouldn't need it other than for the club.
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johnny789



Posts : 209
Join date : 2016-01-16

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Thu Mar 10 2016, 11:56

All good ideas guys, we will certainly have to look at all options. As for sexing up the website, Steve for god's sake keep your clothes on lol!!!.

Another option we could possibly pursue is that many years ago we did have a one of yearly fee which boosts the coffers very quickly. Don't quote me on the number, we could make it anything, but a one of £25 each would raise over three hundred quid. I do realise that some members who don't or can't manage into club as often as others, are at a disadvantage. I am loathe to put up our weekly charge of £5 to anything higher, again that might be a possibility too.

At the moment we now need 7 full paying members in each week to get the £35 that the hall fee has become, we could maybe set a limit of say 5 people in and any lower we would have to cancel the club. That still gives us a shortfall of a tenner that somehow needs made up. A few new members would be a great help .

On the subject of teenage members, does anyone think we should change our policy and actively try recruiting some younger members. We could make the age limit fourteen and over, but there are a few implications there for us. Most of our Ahem!! younger members joined the club as teens are are still with us, although we did lose a lot over the years.

cheers

John
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ScotR



Posts : 241
Join date : 2013-11-25

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Thu Mar 10 2016, 07:45

No, I'm not saying replace the forum in that respect. The forum works for the majority, and would continue to be the hub. Think of the Facebook page as more of a marketing tool to try and catch peoples' attention, engage with them, and then direct them to the forum. It's not about replacing anything, it's about reaching more people.

That's the way we worked it in the site I was involved with before, and that was with hundreds of people across the world, not a dozen guys from Ayrshire, so I'm fairly confident of how that all works in practice.

As for the forum, as it currently stands - which I stress, is functional for us - consists of 1 thread that's regularly active. Everything else is supefluous. Well that's not a forum, that's a chat, or a blog at best.

When we found the club website back in 2012/3, we were inspired to pop along and say hello, which led to us getting back into the hobby. But we knew nothing of the forum until the first time we came and were given the link link for it. That should be part of the site, to allow potential members to contact us and see what we're all about.

And in that respect, while functional, the forum is hardly appealing. Recategorizing it, changing the theme, and (most importantly) an effort from all of us to use it more often in order to flesh it out would work wonders, as opposed to a post once a week to say in or out.

I'm also wondering if we could organise more inter-club games. If we approached the Prestwick and Citadel clubs, who run on a Wednesday and Saturday, and challenge them to some games along the lines of the Sheffield ones. There's no clash, so maybe that might attract them to come join us on the odd Sunday.
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Doc



Posts : 244
Join date : 2011-01-21
Location : In front of my computer Duh!

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Thu Mar 10 2016, 04:19

The main concern I would have over having a forum and a facebook page is either messages are getting missed because they are posted on one but not the other or communication splits with some folk using the forum & some Facebook. To make sure messages aren't missed you then end up having to post messages twice in two different places online & that would get tiresome really quickly.

I'm also not sure how you "sex up" the Forum. Do you invent threads to make it look busy & superfun? This might sound sarcastic, I don't mean I to be. Its an honest question to find out what you are meaning Scot. As far as I see it the Forum is a communication tool for the club.

Going to bed now, but the point of dual channel comms & things being missed was niggling at me Sleep
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ScotR



Posts : 241
Join date : 2013-11-25

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Wed Mar 09 2016, 23:25

I've created a placeholder group on facebook and set it to secret so it can't be found or seen until we reach a consensus on how to go forward with this, and the forum and site are revamped and all three can be integrated. Easily removed if it's a non-starter, but we can work on it in the meantime.

In other news, Stuart, Dave and myself are in on the 20th to try out Dragon Rampant.
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johnny789



Posts : 209
Join date : 2016-01-16

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Wed Mar 09 2016, 23:03

That's right George, whether it is a good idea to restrict our membership to over sixteen or not, I don't know.

Get all your ideas about our website sent to Steve. Rules ,periods played etc will come and go as time passes. Wargaming can be very much the current trend that gets played the most, sometimes only for a couple of months. I have always thought that the variety of games played is one of the big strengths of our club, it never gets boring.

John
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George

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Posts : 273
Join date : 2011-10-30

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Wed Mar 09 2016, 22:34

Our restrictions on under 16 year-old's would help limit that number somewhat but I do believe showing a wider variety of what gets played would be a good idea.

The website's "periods of play" section is almost entirely historical until the last three entries which unfortunately rarely get played nowadays (probably doesn't help that the rulebook pictures are for obsolete editions).
There are several rules sets we are frequently playing which aren't even mentioned.
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johnny789



Posts : 209
Join date : 2016-01-16

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Wed Mar 09 2016, 22:20

Well folks, the creative juices are flowing now lol. Looks like there are lots of good ideas to have a good look at. I for am bit of a dinosaur, and have no intention of joining Facebook or Twitter or any other social media, partly because I find it too much hassle and partly because I can't be arsed. It is another distraction that might take away some of my painting/modelling/historical research. But by all means I do agree that if as a club we could get more exposure, well that can only be a good thing for the club. Half a dozen new members would be fantastic and would go a long way to helping out with the finances. We do have a few hundred quid in our kitty but if only 3 or 4 people can come in and we have to cover the extra cost, the kitty would dry up soon.
It is great that Steve has agreed [ coerced ] lol, to revamp our website as it has been in it's present form for a few years now. One wee thought just crossed my mind as well, a few years ago the Dumfries lads decided to do something similar and put on their site that they often played Magic [ you know, the card game ] and the following week around fifty snotty little teens turned up, so we have to a wee bit careful how we go about all this. Now I have nothing against snotty teens [ well come to think of it, I can't be arsed with them either ] but space for everyone might be a problem in the hall. Keep it up guys, and having a few of our younger members willing to pitch in is great.

cheers John
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George

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Posts : 273
Join date : 2011-10-30

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Wed Mar 09 2016, 20:43

I'd be happy to help out with that as well. I usually check up on the forum almost every day wouldn't be much hassle checking up on Facebook at the same time.
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StuartR



Posts : 50
Join date : 2013-11-24

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Wed Mar 09 2016, 19:43

I am on facebook 24/7 and would find it easier to use - I'd also be willing to admin it. I also understand that facebook isn't for everyone, although I do think it would much more visible than the current set up.
In terms of a dual set up it would be extremely easy to link topics from the forum to the facebook page and making forum registration a pre-requisite of membership on the facebook group would ensure the forum is not left out in the cold.
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ScotR



Posts : 241
Join date : 2013-11-25

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Wed Mar 09 2016, 19:21

It'd not be entirely private Doc. A closed group has a front facing page that outline the club details. Once you've joined it appears in your timeline and you can post to it, a secret group would be entirely hidden, and that'd defeat the purpose, yes. But a closed group would appear in searches and the splash page would host public facing information.

The other option is an open group where anyone can join and post and see, and it appears not only in your timeline but if you post/like something, it'll copy to your friends' timelines. Everything is accessible in this case - posts, photos, members details etc. That may entice people, but lets face it, not everyone wants that repeating on their friendslists.

Some of the biggest wargames pages are closed. I'm a member of a number of them, wargames trading, historical wargames trading, oldhammer trading, Chain of Commmand, Battlegroup, 15mm sci-fi, the list is huge.

One look at our closest clubs - Prestwick and North Ayrshire, shows both approaches. Prestwick has a reasonably active website in terms of blogs, galleries etc, but a closed Facebook page where arrangements and general communication are made. North Ayrshire have a content heavy site with integrated forums and an open facebook page with lots of pics. On a side note, I've just discovered the Games and Theory club that runs on a Saturday at the Citadel through a link on the North Ayrshire page. Maybe worth getting a link on there to us too.

Having an active up-to-date site requires a bit of work though. Our forum needs to be integrated to the site, and to be fleshed out - it needs more than one active thread with a few posts a week to be more functional. A Facebook page would not replace that, but it would compliment it with little in the way of admin required, and reach more people than the forums and site currently do.

I used to be Community Manager for The Online Racing Association, a virtual motorsport organiser. We started with 8 members in 2008. It's currently got over 1500 on its Facebook page alone, and it still operates predominantly from a forum. It took an absolute shitload of work producing content to grow that community, but social media was key to doing so. I had to jack it in 2012 after the wean was born as I didn't have the time, but it has got stronger since - at one point we had a weekly program on Motors TV on Sky, for instance.

The site and forum as is are pretty stagnant. There's much could be done, and hopefully Steve's revamp will help that. While it functions for the current membership, that's clearly not enough to keep the club operating if we're looking at Sundays the club isn't on.

I'm trying not to be you're-playing-it-wrong-Scot (even though you are) here and saying 'we must do this!' I'm trying to put forward my experience and ideas as to how the club could improve prospects, as I don't want to see it flounder. I wish I could commit every Sunday and be there more regularly, but I just can't, and many of us are in that boat. So attracting new members is probably the best avenue to cover costs, and I reckon the foremost way of doing so is increasing online presence.
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George

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Posts : 273
Join date : 2011-10-30

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Wed Mar 09 2016, 17:41

Making a group on Facebook private only hides posted content, the groups description etc is still visible and the group could still be advertised by admin or members posting a link on their status or home page. Plus it's free.

Both idea's have merit and could be implemented.
Increasing member numbers would seem to be something of a necessity as currently we have only around 12-14 regulars of which only just over 50% can make it every week, with new costs we need at least 7-8 per Sunday for a cost effective day.
As Doc said better planning of games would also help.
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Ed McKie

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Posts : 305
Join date : 2011-01-30
Location : Prestwick

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Wed Mar 09 2016, 16:38

I will be in most Sundays from now on, will be in on 20th March but not Easter Sunday.
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Doc



Posts : 244
Join date : 2011-01-21
Location : In front of my computer Duh!

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Wed Mar 09 2016, 15:52

On the answer of more members/consistency. We just need to be smarter about planning our Sundays and being more proactive on the forum to say when we will be in.  I probabliy means some extra forward planning for some people to be able to say what days they would be in so it is known in advance how many people will be in on any given Sunday.

Maybe we could set up a calendar on the forum and people could fill it in?  I'll talk to Steve as it probably needs setup by Administration.

I will be in 20th March.  I am unsure about Easter Sunday, night have something on, I trying to get confirmation.  April I should be in every Sunday.

If there was a Facebook group that was private it defeats your publicity on Facebook arguement Scott. I think we should look at places to get listed on th net. Lists of wargames groups, South Ayrshire What's on/clubs thing, things like that. I need to check as I saw there is/was a wargames group at UWoS. So maybe some info to them would be useful.
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ScotR



Posts : 241
Join date : 2013-11-25

PostSubject: Re: Club Games Planning Area   Tue Mar 08 2016, 22:57

Have got both Falkirk and Claymore booked in as holidays John. Missus wasn't impressed at first, but then I reminded her we don't actually like spending time together, so she was alright after that.

Shame about the club not being able to run weekly. Maybe we can brainstorm some ideas in a few weeks time to see how to get more members/more consistency/more for our money. I'm sure the website is due an overhaul as Steve has asked for ideas, but I think there needs to be a bigger social media presence, ie Facebook. Love it or hate it, it's at the forefront of social media, and can be used effectively for organising weekends, member communication, linking material, and general presentation of the club, while reaching a bigger potential userbase than the forums or website does. It can also be made a closed group so nothing is disclosed to members' feeds and new members can be vetted before accepting them.

I'll disengage salesperson mode now...
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